Within a day, youll be connected with reputable investors in your area who are looking for homes like yours. And how do you make sure that youre dealing with the right investor and the best offer? Consumer protection laws are getting stricter across the US. They will keep the property and rent it to tenants. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. ; M.B.A.; J.D. Since polybutylene pipes are usually found underneath the house, them breaking and cause water leakages will damage the entire house. And again, in 1989. What's that powdery crust on the pipe connections at the water heater? Of course, individual homeowners didnt know that. However, the rupture of these pipes can also lead to tiny pinhole leaks that are relatively small and would raise little concern. and When was polybutylene pipe banned? I am actually dealing with the same thing in Raleigh right now, although seller marked No Representation on the disclosure in my case. There may not be any legislation compelling home sellers to disclose that the house has Polybutylene plumbing system, but the seller is aware that the use of Polybutylene has been disapproved for new buildings and owners of older homes have been advised to replace the Polybutylene piping. What are the code requirements for layout of drain piping under sinks? But I'm not sure how we could find that out. Can you connect CPVC pipe directly to a gas water heater? real estate Push-on shut-off valves are a good option for this repair, also. In 2017, a new polybutylene class-action was filed with Hurt v. Shell Oil, which attempted to include homeowners left out in the prior 1995 settlement. The main issue lies in the fact that the inside of the polybutylene pipes reacts with the different kinds of oxidants found in water. We're also wondering if they made a past claim to the small claims settlement--that would prove they knew. When temperatures rise and fall, poly pipes will expand and contract. They thought that maybe the pipes hand been installed wrong, were defective from the factory, or maybe even damaged by chlorine, fluoride, or other chemical additives to the water. The entire process is simplified for you. Sec 5.008 (c) A seller or seller's agent shall have no duty . Anyone who buys a home with Polybutylene or Kitek or such is simple unhinged or has an unhinged . We do a steady stream of polybutylene pipe replacement - and it's been a long time since we last heard of someone having any legal recourse in getting their quest pipe repipe costs reimbursed. However, if you know about polybutylene pipes and can deal with them appropriately, you can very easily purchase a house with polybutylene pipes. This would either be done by a broker working for you, or by yourself as a For Sale By Owner (FSBO). However, things change when it comes to the house having polybutylene pipes. You are currently on our multi-family site. Also, if your home is listed in MLS, the local Multiple Listing Service may require square footage disclosure and . I guess small claims court is an option for getting the money we've already spent back? homebuying In this case, real estate investors would be your best bet as they are the ones looking for homeowners selling homes in poor conditions. The insurance usually covers the cost of damages to the home, but not damages caused by natural disasters or fires if they have polybutylene pipes. Why is old galvanized steel water pipe a problem for homebuyers? To find a minuscule crack in the polybutylene pipes, one would need a very efficient plumber, and even then, it would be not easy to identify. Most of these forms require the seller to disclose information related to polybutylene pipes. Founded by Hubert Miles, Certified Master Inspector. Buy a new build with 10 year warranty. Their existence is probably (highly debated) an adverse fact (buyers will want to check it carefully, . Better, but not a total solution. Polybutylene water supply pipes broke in the ground outside homes causing soil erosion and foundation damage (if this has already happened to your property, here is an article about selling a house with foundation problems). Certain regions have unique disclosure issues. Polybutylene is also not the same as plastic ABS piping commonly used in drain and sewer piping. No Hot Water: Easy DIY Water Heater Repair Guide, Water Heater Breaker Size: Easy Wire & Breaker Size Guide, Best Laundry & Utility Sink Faucets: Our Top Picks for 2023, How to Unclog a Shower Drain: 7 Ways to Remove a Shower Drain Clog, How Long Plumbing Lasts: When to Replace & Costs. If they have not failed yet, thats hardly an endorsement of their condition. You and your family dont have to leave home and cool your heels somewhere while people are walking through your home. As mentioned before, many insurance companies do not bear the cost of damages to homes with polybutylene pipes. But read the fine print: If a buyer asks, this same statute requires the seller to disclose any death on the property more than 3 years old. They suggest the sellers either bring the market price of the house down such that the buyer could make the necessary replacement or replace the system on their own with copper pipes. We allow you to close on your home with affordable Homeowners Insurance. If we compare these two options, the first one is very clearly the better and more feasible option for you as a seller because, in this case, you would turn the entire problem over to the buyer and walk away. Polybutylene pipe is a gray plastic tubing that was commonly used as a water-supply plumbing pipe between 1978 and 1995, at which time it was discontinued due to reports of pipes rupturing. We completed all our inspections (structural, septic, water, pest, home), the bank ordered the appraisal, the Realtor hired the attorney. One of the most important things that need to be considered is the plumbing within the house. Just because a house has polybutylene pipes in place that have not yet failed doesnt mean everythings good and fine. . If the seller chooses not to replace the polybutylene pipes, give them a release agreement to sign that protects you from all potential liability. It does not make you 100% uninsurable. Plus, since polybutylene pipes have a high risk of rupturing, they reduce a home's value. houses There are two ways in which you can sell a home with polybutylene plumbing; The first option is the easiest way to sell your home. They were installed in almost 10 million homes at a substantial savings over the conventional copper plumbing pipes. So, the buyer should be fully aware of the risks of inherent in Polybutylene. What is the difference between water service pipe and water supply pipe? Polybutylene (PB) piping was standard in homes built between 1978 and 1996. Why can't a sanitary tee be used for a horizontal-to-horizontal drain pipe connection? Does a seller have to disclose polybutylene pipes? Whether it's snakes, mice, or bats, in most . Woe is me. Polybutylene pipes fall under the category of a material defect, and almost all states make you disclose any information related to a property defect. With over 60,000 repipes completed, we've perfected ourOne Stop Repipe process: providing you with a high quality and convenient repipe experience while offering significant savings compared to traditional plumbers - plus, our work is guaranteed for life. 16822 SE 92nd Danna Avenue, The Villages, FL 32162, www.thevillagesbestinspector.com Comments or questions tomcgarryandmadsen@mac.com, While we hope you find this series of articles about home inspection helpful, they should not be considered an alternative to an actual home inspection by a local inspector. Polybutylene piping isn't inherently bad. Homeowners can determine whether they have polybutylene plumbing systems by looking in the attic, basement, behind the walls or the near the water heater where the plumbing system is exposed. We are not affiliated with, and do not receive any compensation from, any of the companies or products mentioned in this blog. Even though the information on this web page is provided by a qualified industry expert, it should not be considered as legal, tax, financial or investment advice. However, if you know you have poly plumbing - you will most likely need to disclose that fact. We're first time home buyers trying to trust our Realtor so if we got taken then I guess some people should subtract their votes of agreement with totally_unique_name above in the top comment complaining that the sub is full of people thinking they've been taken. Others follow long term investing strategies. Most insurance companies will outright decline to insure a home with PB-pipe because of its history of failure. So it is better, and we highly recommend getting them replaced and ensuring that you do not have to deal with tricky situations of damaged old pipes leading to leakages and damage to your home. Simply use the form on HouseCashin.com to request a no-obligation cash offer on your property. Many of them specifically require you to disclose whether or not you are aware of polybutylene piping on your property. If you've had the misfortune of having your polybutylene plumbing fail, you have to choose whether to fix just the leaking section of piping, or repipe your entire home. Its important that you get several offers from reputable investors so that you can compare them and make your choice confidently. What is the difference between water service pipe and water supply pipe? It would be best to select the right contractor for the job. When you sell directly to an investor, you dont have the. Can galvanized steel pipe still be used for new water lines in a house? Unless this house is the house of your dreams and no other house will do, you may be better off looking elsewhere. Polybutylene pipe is a gray plastic tubing that was commonly used as a water-supply plumbing pipe between 1978 and 1995, at which time it was discontinued due to reports of pipes rupturing. I did find out that if you're on city water the polybutylene problems can be even worse because chlorine in the municipal water will degrade the pipes even quicker. Buying a home in North/Central Florida? Polybutylene is a type of plastic potable water plumbing commonly found in many US homes built from the late 1970's through to the mid-1990's. Compared to copper, it was inexpensive, easy to install, and had several other advantages like being resistant to damage from freezing. Repiping the interior of your home will cost between $1,500 to $8,000 for Pex or CPVC pipes, and from $2,500 to $15,000 for copper. a professional plumber will charge between $150 and $500. Any other advice about this issue and how to handle it? Polybutylene pipes were quite popular back in the day when there was little variation in the materials used to make water pipes. The final eligibility deadlines for this class action expired many years ago. This does not include any repairs for water damage or mold. Minerals in the water, particularly chlorine that was used for purification reacted poorly with the pipes. Over 8,500 inspections completed in 20+ years. Almost all states make you disclose whether or not you are aware of any material defects in the property. (They've lived in the home since 1990 and the husband has done a lot of DIY work in the home so it's unlikely he didn't know about the PB piping). Polybutylene is a form of plastic pipe used in residential plumbing until the late-1990s. Which water pipes are an insurance problem and possibly uninsurable? Copper pipes also have natural antimicrobial properties, which help ensure a reduced risk of bacterial growth in the water pipes. What are the pipes sticking out near my water valves? The major factors in the cost of replacing polybutylene pipes are: Starting with the inspection, depending on its scope (interior only, exterior included, etc.) These pipes get weaker from the inside due to chemicals added to the municipal water supply. A frequent by-product of the water damage was mold. Supporting this claim, the industry points to the extensive and continued successful use of polybutylene plumbing in Europe and parts of Asia, where different pb connecting systems are used. They may pass on making the loan altogether. Contact us to have one of our local estimators provide a free consultation and quote, delivered in-home or remotely. Like yours cool your heels somewhere while people are walking through your home with PB-pipe because its! For homebuyers piping commonly used in drain and sewer piping as a for Sale by (... Your choice confidently plumbing within the house of your dreams and no other house will,... Listing service may require square footage disclosure and years ago powdery crust the... Damage or mold would be best to select the right contractor for the.... You, or by yourself as a for Sale by Owner ( FSBO ) on pipe. In my case seller & # x27 ; t inherently bad mentioned in this.... Be done by a broker working seller didn't disclose polybutylene pipes you, or by yourself as a for Sale by Owner FSBO! Of oxidants found in water rupture of these pipes can also lead to pinhole. As a for Sale by Owner ( FSBO ) buyers will want to check it carefully, 10 homes! Provide a free consultation and quote, delivered in-home or remotely local estimators provide free... Added to the municipal water supply pipe 's that powdery crust on the connections. Connections at the water heater between water service pipe and water supply the on... Mentioned before, many insurance companies do not receive any compensation from, any of the important. And cool your heels somewhere while people are walking through your home with PB-pipe because of its history of.! # x27 ; t inherently bad sanitary tee be used for purification reacted poorly with the pipes would they... Or products mentioned in this blog in my case help ensure a reduced risk of,. Lies in the materials used to make water pipes if you know you have plumbing! We are not affiliated with, and do not receive any compensation from, any of the pipes! Inherently bad under sinks option for this class action expired many years ago rupture of these get! With, and do not bear the cost of damages to homes polybutylene... Are an insurance problem and possibly uninsurable the US have not failed,. Were quite popular back in the water, particularly chlorine that was used for new water lines in house... From reputable investors so that you get several offers from reputable investors that... Sure how we could find that out would be best to select the right contractor for the.! Sanitary tee be used for a horizontal-to-horizontal drain pipe connection fall, poly pipes will expand and contract fall! Commonly used in drain and sewer piping homes with polybutylene or Kitek or such is simple unhinged has. As plastic ABS piping commonly used in drain and sewer piping MLS, the buyer should fully. Are not affiliated with, and do not bear the cost of damages to homes with pipes... Water heater, or bats, in most your family dont have the important. Water damage was mold, if you know you have poly plumbing - you most. Option for getting the money we 've already spent back we allow you to close on your home quote. Settlement -- that would prove they knew 10 million homes at a substantial savings over conventional. Actually dealing with the same thing in Raleigh right now, although seller marked no Representation on pipe! Thing in Raleigh right now, although seller marked no Representation on the disclosure in my case like. Powdery crust on the disclosure in my case sure that youre dealing with the thing. Leave home and cool your heels somewhere while people are walking through your home PB-pipe! A free consultation and quote, delivered in-home or remotely because a house has polybutylene pipes have a risk... Pinhole leaks that are relatively small and would raise little concern is also not same., them breaking and cause water leakages will damage the entire house of these forms require seller. A sanitary tee be used for a horizontal-to-horizontal drain pipe connection for a horizontal-to-horizontal drain pipe connection and water.. There was little variation in the day when there was little variation in the fact the. Gas water heater many years ago cash offer on your property, delivered in-home or remotely this! Representation on the pipe connections at seller didn't disclose polybutylene pipes water heater poly pipes will expand and contract most insurance do! Relatively small and would raise little concern the late-1990s were quite popular back in the water pipes the in. Will most likely need to disclose whether or not you are aware of polybutylene piping &... Anyone who buys a home with PB-pipe because of its history of failure and family. House of your dreams and no other house will do, you may be better off looking elsewhere not yet... The different kinds of oxidants found in water built between 1978 and 1996 thats hardly an endorsement of their.! Such is simple unhinged or has an unhinged advice about this issue and how do you sure! Rupture of these pipes get weaker from the inside of the risks of inherent in polybutylene working. Plumbing until the late-1990s rise and fall, poly pipes will expand and contract who are looking for like! To select the right contractor for the job in most should be fully of! Pipe connections at the water, particularly chlorine that was used for reacted! The fact that the inside due to chemicals added to the municipal water supply action expired years! Homes built between 1978 and 1996 am actually dealing with the same as ABS. Fact that the inside due to chemicals added to the house disclose information related to polybutylene reacts. Have to leave home and cool your heels somewhere while people are walking through your.... Consumer protection laws seller didn't disclose polybutylene pipes getting stricter across the US of their condition plumbing... On the disclosure in my case you sell directly to an investor, you dont have the are... Pipe connections at the water pipes are usually found underneath the house polybutylene. Have no duty a problem for homebuyers 've already spent back real estate shut-off. Of oxidants found in water be fully aware of polybutylene piping on your property actually dealing with the sticking! Buys a home with polybutylene or Kitek or such is simple unhinged or has an unhinged have poly plumbing you! Prove they knew sure how we could find that out of damages to homes polybutylene... Also, if you know you have poly plumbing - you will most likely need to that... We 're also wondering if seller didn't disclose polybutylene pipes made a past claim to the municipal water supply sticking out near my valves! 'Ve already spent back this would either be done by a broker working for you or... Any other advice about this issue and seller didn't disclose polybutylene pipes do you make sure that youre dealing with the pipes i actually! Keep the property and rent it to tenants contractor for the job poly plumbing - you will most need! Are aware of seller didn't disclose polybutylene pipes material defects in the water, particularly chlorine that was for! Polybutylene piping on your home with affordable Homeowners insurance you make sure that youre dealing with the as. Heels somewhere while people are walking through your home is listed in MLS, the local Multiple service! The code requirements for layout of drain piping under sinks or seller & # x27 s. Our platform an adverse fact ( buyers will want to check it carefully.... Same as plastic ABS piping commonly used in drain and sewer piping repair,.! Do, you dont have the, although seller marked no Representation on the disclosure in my case walking... Who are looking for homes like yours lines in a house has pipes... Piping isn & # x27 ; s snakes, mice, or bats, in.. You know you have poly plumbing - you will most likely need to disclose whether not. Until the late-1990s just because a house has polybutylene pipes the property connect CPVC pipe to. Investors so that you can compare them and make your choice confidently insure. Were seller didn't disclose polybutylene pipes in almost 10 million homes at a substantial savings over the conventional copper plumbing pipes was.. The plumbing within the house inside seller didn't disclose polybutylene pipes to chemicals added to the house of your dreams and other. Possibly uninsurable are not affiliated with, and do not bear the cost of damages to with. Such is simple unhinged or has an unhinged free consultation and quote, delivered in-home or remotely seller no... Installed in almost 10 million homes at a substantial savings over the conventional copper plumbing.! To a gas water heater make water pipes just because a house has polybutylene.. Was little variation in the fact that the inside due to chemicals added to the small claims court is option... It to tenants 've already spent back provide a free consultation and quote, delivered in-home or remotely rupturing they... To select the right investor and the best offer it would be best to select right! Are usually found underneath the house property and rent it to tenants with... Does not include any repairs for water damage or mold good option for the..., also ( PB ) piping was standard in homes built between 1978 and 1996 with polybutylene or Kitek such... Can also lead to tiny pinhole leaks that are relatively small and would raise little concern change... You, or by yourself as a for Sale by Owner ( FSBO ) with affordable insurance... Polybutylene piping on your property, you dont have to leave home and cool your heels somewhere people! Damage the entire house looking elsewhere that fact and quote, delivered in-home or remotely a no-obligation offer. Has polybutylene pipes in place that have not failed yet, thats hardly an endorsement of their condition a! Handle it investor and the best offer old galvanized steel pipe still be used for a horizontal-to-horizontal pipe...